V3m, tone quest continued...

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UnexplodedCow
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Re: V3m, tone quest continued...

Postby UnexplodedCow » Mon Aug 07, 2017 3:37 pm

chrose1201 wrote:So I have been going through this thread as I am looking for the right tone for me. This weekend at a gig the sound guy said that my guitar sounded like midrange sandpaper or something equally annoying. Now this guy was a definitely a d-bag... aside from that though it hurt because I think he's right.... I switch between an American Deluxe Strat with noiseless pups and a Jem Jr. I run it through my V3M and a Tech21 Flyrig RK5. In my band we will play smooth jazz, to disco, to Prince, to Dolly Parton, to Santana and everything in between. I was looking at ways to get a good sound from the V3M and found a review of the V3M that for me is what I have been feeling.

"as for the V3M, I cant recommend them. Honestly aside from the name and the similar look the amps sound nothing alike. I wanted to love the V3M as it didnt have those pesky globals but the amp has very poor sound. Some amps you struggle to find a bad tone, the V3M is the opposite. I struggled to find a good one. For a lack of better description the V3M sounds like a fart through a tubescreamer, I **** you not. A good example of the poor tone is Carvins very own demo video with kevin michael from sledd. The ONLY thing that gets that amp to have any definition and clarity is a TS type boost pedal. Without it I would have to rate it in the top 5 worst tube amps for rock and metal in recent years."


The cleans are very nice, I do not bother with Channel 1 ( I mostly use channel 2) and I hoped the RK5 would have been the answer. I returned the first RK5 because the noise was HORRIBLE, they sent me a new one and it's much better, but still I cannot get a smooth OD tone out of it. I would use my Laney 1-12" SS as it has a great tone, but I can't trust the fuses at a louder volume, and I don't even play that loud! I have never gotten the master past 4.5. I was hoping that maybe an attenuator would smooth out the tone, but now I suspect not.
All of the pros I have seen have been able to get a smooth tone and quiet from their rigs. Joe Bonamassa manages to turn town in certain passages to about a .5 in volume and it's as if its not plugged in at all! Nary a hint of noise! This problem seems to come though from the RK5, or my wah. All I want is to be able to get a smooth singing tone if you will, the likes of Clapton, Whispering a prayer, Santana Europa etc. Obviously most of the tone is in their ability, but can someone recommend a set up that will give me a quiet OD that can sing? All this talk about swapping tubes, and biasing, etc is more than I am going to do. It's a bit over my head honestly. My days of playing live are nearing a close (hopefully not too soon, but you never know) and I want to finally after all these years have something decent! Thanks for listening to my whining!


If your amp was mic'd up, try using a different speaker. I went with Cannabis Rex speakers in a ported 212, and that gave me all the low bass response I could handle. I didn't like the amp so much with Vintage 30s. Of course, the soundguy was rude, but there is a potentially fatiguing sound in the V3m, depending on the setting. I found it was particularly noticeable with the EQ-X engaged, and with a high presence level. Kinda gritty. I also swapped tubes to calm it.

The V3m *CAN* do a great OD sound if tweaked. The sounds are there. Also, Channel 2 is identical to Channel 1. The amp has a very wide range of adjustment, and is a tweaker's dream. I believe just about any sound can come out of one, though it takes time. It's not like a Fender, Marshall, or even the Legacy series...it is more of a jack.

Personally, I had a V3m, and it took a long time to dial it in. Once I did, I left it there, and tweaked the guitar side. Eventually I snagged a Legacy 3, and find that amp to give me the sound I want. If you want a singing tone, I think the L3 gives it better than the V3m, though the latter can be tweaked to sound like the former (and is how I set the amp). It's a bit easier to dial in due to being more focused in its function. However, I think its cleans are the best of the bunch, its ODs are smoother, and the lead sound is particularly excellent. It's not a modern type of high gain, though. The V3m was similar to my ISP Theta in how it could be tweaked, and how heavy a distortion it could get.

If you're not happy, give a Legacy 3 a whirl. It really is that good.

tbonesullivan
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Re: V3m, tone quest continued...

Postby tbonesullivan » Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:20 pm

Speaker choice is always key and also mic placement as well. Maybe using an ISO cab or some other cabinet designed for recording would be better.
Guitar Amps: Vintage 16, X-100B Series IV, MTS3212, V3M, XB-212 Half Stack, AGD100
Bass Amps: PB100-15, B800 Stack, RL600 Stack
Pro Audio: AC120, AC120S, XP4 x2

mmstrat
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Re: V3m, tone quest continued...

Postby mmstrat » Thu Oct 05, 2017 7:34 pm

12AX7's shipped from the Factory - Got my V2m last year

All 12AX7s were JJ ECC83 (1, 3, 4) except Pos 2, which has no lettering on it at all which other posters are indicating is the 1 Chinese tube.

Just replaced V1 with the Electro Harmonix 12AY7 6072 and V2 with the JJ 5751 last nite. Will crank it up tonight and see what the difference is !
Last edited by mmstrat on Mon Oct 09, 2017 3:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

esrsteve
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Re: V3m, tone quest continued...

Postby esrsteve » Sat Oct 07, 2017 2:34 pm

V1 12ay7, V2 5751. That is my secret sauce. Hope it works for you!

mmstrat
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Re: V3m, tone quest continued...

Postby mmstrat » Mon Oct 09, 2017 3:41 pm

Absolutely agree ersteve, same as you now, and played it this weekend.

The EH 12ay7 in V1 definitely has a different tonal spectrum than the original JJ ECC83s (Channel 3). Had to adjust the mid and treble to get the brightness back to where I like it, but was able to increase the volume a little as well. Sounds very good there.

The 5751 in V2 made a nice difference as well. The distortion in Channel 2 seems smoother and creamier (my preferrence) but no worries, because when it is toggled on "instense" it is obviously intense, even on Drive setting of 4 or so! I really like it and seems more usable. For channel 1 there is less noise but the same intensity if you need it. I have the drive there set to around 1-2 o'clock for bigger leads, although typically Channel 2 with a boost is usually enough.

I also feel that that 5751 in V2 makes both Channel 1 and 2 more articulate, you can hear the differences between toggle settings more apparently, at least to me.

Running at 7 or 22 watts, those channels still retain plenty of gain with this tube substitution.

esrsteve
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Re: V3m, tone quest continued...

Postby esrsteve » Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:49 am

Additional to the pre tubes being changed I am also running the amp on only 2 EL84 tubes. I use the 50 watt setting to send full voltage to the V4 phase inverter tube. This setup has excellent dynamic response and is not overly loud. I love this amp!

jnoel64
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Re: V3m, tone quest continued...

Postby jnoel64 » Thu Oct 12, 2017 4:55 pm

For the past couple years, I've been running these:
V1 - Mesa SPAX7,
V2 - JJ 12AY7,
V3 - JJ EC83S,
V4 - Sovtek 12AX7LPS

A couple nights ago, I found my JAN-Phillips 5751 in another amp. I pulled it and put that in V2. I also changed V1 to an EH 12AY7. I found the results to be fairly similar to what I was running before with the exception of the clean channel now feeling a bit more open. I couldn't run the amp at gig levels, but I was still able to note the slight difference. I may try a JAN-Phillips 12AT7 in the PI slot again. The last time I did that, the clean channel was a little too open for my tastes, but I can't help myself from experimenting and giving that tube a second shot. The V3M responds well to tube changes!

I was hoping to find a JAN 12AY7, but haven't had any luck. The only other NOS 12AY7 I found was an RCA for $99.99. Not going that route. The JAN-Phillips 5751 was just over $50 when I bought it. Now, they are closer to $60. If I could find an NOS 12AY7 in that price range, I might consider it, but wonder if I would really notice enough of a difference to warrant the cost. That was true with the 5751 and has been true with the JAN-Phillips 12AT7, so I would have to guess it would also be true if I found a JAN version of the 12AY7.

I have yet to install my Preferred Series power tubes. From the reviews I read on them, I should be very happy with the results. Just not up for a re-biasing at the moment. Plus, the JJs I am currently running are doing great, so I may just wait until they start to go bad.

esrsteve
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Re: V3m, tone quest continued...

Postby esrsteve » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:49 pm

Speaking of speakers, my absolute favorite for the V3m is a Jensen Blackbird Alnico in a Carvin 1x12 closed back cabinet. There are not enough adjectives to describe just how phenominal this speaker sounds. Quite pricey but OMG!!


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